In fact, I dont like that. And I think that was the best decision that I made, but Im actually very happy that I went through that experience because it really taught me how to relate to what a lot of people are going through today. So of course, Christ does not will for any of the controversies in the Catholic Church, but He may allow for it. It was the first-century Jewish historian Josephus who coined the termtheocracyto describe the Palestinian Jews belief that God was the King of Israel and its earthly leaders were his proxies. Stay away from thinking that one is true and the others are false. Its perfectly fine, youre still fully in communion with the Catholic Church. Well, there is a local Greek Orthodox Church that I was able to find refuge in. Eastern Orthodoxy | Definition, Origin, History, & Facts But also, there are different types of the word 'love' being used. No Who do you talk to? Catholic Christianity offers the world the fullness of the Christian Faith. Thats okay. Where have you heard it in a position light? If I became Orthodox, I would have to accept more Catholic things than I at first thought: purgatory, for example. Catholic Vs Orthodox Beliefs: (14 Major Differences To Know) He explains why he concluded he needed to be in communion with the pope, and why every Christian should. It may not display this or other websites correctly. As to the reference to the sheep, that is just pastoral duties - remember that Orthodox believe that all bishops are inheritors of St. Peter - this command is to all bishops. we'll be happy to answer it! Second, Pope Benedict is Patriarch of the West. The primary function of the ministers is to administer the Sacred Mysteries (Sacraments), which, because they communicate the divine life, assist us in the process of theosis. Or how do people make that decision? Even if they dont formally transfer their right, theres nothing wrong with going and attending weekly. What can the Church offer me? If one of the younger kids says, I dont want to listen to you. And the only antidote to entropy is decision, you have to choose. The question was whether it did so in the most prudent manner. Okay. It is a thing to be endured sometimes we dont know why Christ asks us to endure these things, but we can take up our cross, we can live our vocation. 1. 13:17), and if Jesus put one particular minister over the others, it would be understood that he had authority over them. By our membership in the Church, we are incorporated into Christ himself and receive the gifts of the Holy Spirit. I dont think its going to happen in our lifetime and Im seeing things that are taking things further away from that union. No, I don't think its true. Ultimately, though, I recognized that it was not up to me to decide this question; it was up to the Church. I think theres what, at this point, 23, 24? 5/23/2017 4 Comments Original source: Journey to Orthodoxy . That would help tremendously, I currently have very little income and wouldn't be able to purchase the book for myself for quite some time. Its not to say they dont have valid sacraments. It may not display this or other websites correctly. One of the reasons why I think thats bad, even for Catholics is because as a Catholic you should want to see reunion with Eastern Orthodox. It's also true, however, that we do not necessarily need the bishop of Rome. Here, "orthodox" means the same as "faithful and accurate." Faith is serious business. Protestant here. Why should I be Orthodox? : r - Reddit Yes B. We must be transformed through prayer, sacramental participation and self-discipline. but these should all be trumped by the answers to the following two questions: All traditions within orthodox Christianity (and by orthodox I mean universally-accepted Trinitarian Christianity) offer a lot of truth. Im opposed to it. But to worship in spirit and truth, we must stand in the Tradition of the Church. Looks like I spouted some hardcore Protestant heresy. Both have great holiness and great wickedness in their histories, and making a judgment based on the variable tides of history would be unwise. As a BetterHelp affiliate, we may receive compensation from BetterHelp if you purchase products or services through the links provided. Common sense would suggest that God is more likely to guide the group that possesses an institution to a correct understanding of it. By belonging to the Church, we are taken up into Christ and we become members of his Body (cf. I dont know whats going on in their house, but at my house no ones volunteering. 2. I think the Patriarch of Constantinople would be willing, but its more on Moscows end that theyre not willing to share. There is a lack of communion. A. The focus on Christs glorious resurrection and destruction of death by death in Orthodoxy bears more fruit in my soul than the focus on Christ paying our penalty for sin in Catholicism. Again, were just so delighted with the association. I was once Roman Catholic. Yeah, and you know what? I have more questions, but these are the two that are the most important to me, please share your thoughts below. The Nicene Creed was created to fight heresies, and heretics didnt stop inventing new ones after it was penned. The Thing I can't stand is that in Orthodoxy there's more And more synods approving Contraception, And It doesn't sound Right to me. Where we have in the Eastern Catholic Churches, you do have some national aspects to them. We enlist those gathered about the throne of God to join their prayers with ours. Its whenever you start to say that, My culture is superior to yours and Im going to look down on you. Okay, thats when you have problems, but again, that has been objectively condemned by the Orthodox. The 21 Coptic Martyrs: More Orthodox Saints in the Catholic Church, Pope to pope: Let our churches be united by Christs love. Why the Church? And the reason why I dont recommend it, having not only experienced it but just continuing to reflect on this objectively, I should say. And in fact, I mentioned Assisi 1986, unfortunately there are quite a few Orthodox representatives that participated in that event. Why should I be Orthodox instead of Catholic? : r - Reddit Doing so will make much of what you have read come alive, in the sense of seeing how that about which you have read is actually lived. Think of it in the following way. How can a human being be brought into the life of the Trinitarian God? and our Right? As for supremacy, it makes no sense that the Bishop of Rome would depose a bishop in Ethiopia, Armenia, Russia, or anywhere else out of his immediate jurisdiction. It seemed to me that it was easier to explain matters if one accepted the second possibility: The Catholic Church is the Bride of Christ and the Orthodox are, regrettably, in schism at present. But where would I end up? Rome became pre-eminent because it was the largest, most populated, and yes, richest city I. We do liturgy. When the Northern Kingdom seceded from the South in Israel, a question arose about the Jerusalem temple. My experiences attending Catholic Mass with friends versus going to Divine Liturgy at Orthodox parishes has led me to believe that there is something special about the mindset of Eastern Orthodox Christianity, which focuses on the holistic healing of the human person, as opposed to Western Catholic Christianity, which often has scholastic tendencies and focuses on theological minutiae. Obviously, I am asking in a biased place but why should I become a catholic and not an orthodox? In the same way that Catholicism did about 1 year ago. And I spent about three years in Eastern Orthodoxy but the entire time I continued to study the issue was involving Catholicism and Orthodoxy. Thats right. When you look at the entirety of the Roman papacy in the first 1,000 years of the Church, its plain that he in no way/shape/form was considered supreme or infallible. Our loyalty should be to God alone. Now, and I will say on the flip side in Catholicism, you do have that aspect subjectively as well. I agree here, with your standpoint. Telegram | So there then becomes practical problems of, Okay, well, which Orthodox Church do I join?. Catholicism also has things to attract a rightly disposed Evangelical: the liturgy, the Eucharist, confession, confirmation, Sacred Tradition, apostolic succession. Its adherents live mainly in the Balkans, the Middle East, and former Soviet countries. Or scripture? Ex. EDIT: Just googled it. How is this possible? Should I Convert To Catholicism? Find Out With This Quiz I dont know if I could make an argument, but I can sense thats a metaphysical impossibility. There have been more books published since, and much information is available on the Internet (which wasnt commercially available then), but at the time I was limited to a few books on Orthodoxy by Jaroslav Pelikan and Timothy (now Bishop Kallistos) Ware. It was inserted later by Western Christians and eventually authorized by the pope. The absence of a pope from Eastern Orthodoxy clearly had negative effects. All rights reserved. And why would we ever want to walk away from that? Or am I wrong? Would you invite someone to make the journey from that Orthodox Church into the Byzantine Catholic communion? I just didnt yet recognize him as the rock. Michael Lofton, one of those and considering his journey, we thought wed ask him, Does it make sense, given the scandals, given all the really ugliness in the Catholic Church in recent decades, to maybe leave for a time and go over to Orthodoxy? Heres what Michael Lofton had to say. And so, we have to pray and its not a hopeless situation, God can heal anything, but I dont think we should just act like theres always time. And the more I studied, the more I became convinced of the necessity of being in communion with the Bishop of Rome. Even if the Nicene Creed was sufficient to meet the theological challenges of its own day, changing circumstances might call for the creation of new creeds or even a revision of the Nicene Creed itselffor example, if heretics found an insidious way of misinterpreting some of its clauses. 1 Cor. MPowered Christian Ministries, a division of MPowered Living, Inc. How do I know if I am ready to perform exorcism? Theres plenty of reasons to leave, there always will be, but now they seem particularly a cute doesnt mean its time to leave. One who would claim that he or she wishes to embrace the faith but doesnt want to get involved with other people and their lives falls short in his or her understanding of the Church as the People of God and, as such, has yet to make that internal conversion that must take place before one is received into the Church. Because Christ himself willed its existence in order that we might achieve the goal to which we are called: theosis - participation in the divine life. Do you happen to have any quotes? 3. When we fall or tire, we can depend on our fellow believers to help us persevere. Including the word makes the Creed inaccurate. So thats what St. Maximus the Confessor Institute is. Why should I be Orthodox instead of Catholic? - Christian Forums Orthodox dont traditionally use the wordpurgatoryfor the purification that happens after death, but they acknowledge that such a purification happens. And the Catholic tendency to say, Well, God didnt call the country, He called the church.. Obey your conscience, live faithfully, pray diligently, keep learning more and more, and continuously humble yourself and be willing to change your mindallowing the Holy Spirit to guide you into the truth. But, the liturgical problems within the Catholic Church are in some places minor, in other places they almost cried to heaven with this scandal. While by no means exhaustive or comprehensive, I here offer three reasons why I personally am an Orthodox Christian instead of a Catholic one: Orthodoxy has kept the liturgical tradition of the Church in ways that Catholicism hasnt. First, regardless of which side was right, this approach would require laity on one of the two sides to embrace schism or heresy. theres mitigating circumstances, but objectively speaking, its being disobedient. yeah, but most of the Fathers say that it was St Peter's confession that was the rock, and that is why Simon was named Peter. Steps to "becoming" an Orthodox Christian - Questions & Answers But if were just focusing on this objective and we dont really know what things really look like feet on the ground in the Orthodox Church, there might be a lure there. So theres a lot of strengths that Catholicism has that they would benefit from. And I came to the conviction that providentially it seems that God is saying, I need to go to Orthodoxy, which I did. Alessandra Benedetti / Corbis via Getty Image. If the Church of Russia needs to depose a bishop it is not the Ecumenical Patriarch that does it, it is the Russian synod of bishops/patriarch. So in a practical sense, if I leave Rome and head towards Greece, what will I find? A. And I put them in authority to do that. Which Christianity took a foothold. Not some taken out of context, because the majority I have seen, seem that they support the Papacy. (Much more can be said on this subject, including the way it is possible to harmonize the Catholic and Orthodox positions on the matter, but this reflects what I could see at the time. Very grateful to Michael Lofton taking the time with us. In this post, we list some of the differences between the Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic Churches. So in their-. So I really appreciate yall. And were just delighted that hes going to be an affiliate here of us at Catholic Answers. I concluded that I would have to bite the bullet and accept the hard sayings of the Catholic Church. 7 MAIN differences between Catholicism and Orthodox Christianity If you think contraception is wrong, then don't use it. Really? The Mission of The Orthodox Church in America, the local autocephalous Orthodox Christian Church, is to be faithful in fulfilling the commandment of Christ to Go into all the world and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. Its on, again, YouTube and podcasts, Stitcher, iTunes, all that good stuff. This still left me to consider whether the Holy Spiritdoesproceed from the Fatherandthe Son. It might seem like a small matter, but it pertains to the inner life of God, and that makes it important. Youre actually describing my situation. Theyre all fully in communion with the Roman pontiff and so theres nothing wrong with being a Latin Right christian who ends up going to an Eastern Catholic Church. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. how to structure the church and how to have primacy in the church mixed with synodality. After the Apostolic period the administration of these gifts became the duty and privilege of the bishops and presbyters. How does this happen? Look at all the conflicting doctrines found in the Protestant denominations - do you think none of them have scripture verses backing them up? To be able to do penance and be purified, we need the sustenance which the Church provides in its liturgical life and its sacraments. 12:4-5; 1 Cor 12:12-14,27). After all, Jesus had some hard sayings himself. it blurs the distinction between Father and Son by saying that the Spirit's origin is in Them both. Perhaps God in his Providence is showing me, Michael, you made the wrong choice. So youre going to find some of those doctrinal problems. is very difficult. Okay. Galli's concern about ecclesial division, according to the RNS article, "left him exhausted.". So what I did is I built a home chapel and I reached out to an Eastern Catholic priest who is four and a half hours away and asked, Would you be willing to come out and celebrate divine liturgies on occasion? I dont say that in any kind of joyful way, I think that the problem of sin, youre going to find in any communion out there. The claim that the Creed was inviolable and can never validly be revised seemed implausible on its face. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. One of the things that I think that is actually a barrier between Protestants, especially many evangelical or fundamentalist Protestants, but many Protestants in the United States and Catholics, is our understanding of the role of the nation in our faith. The prayer of one member of the Church is enhanced and echoed in the prayers of the entire communion of saints. For an Evangelical discovering more traditional forms of Christianity, accepting certain Catholic beliefs ( purgatory, indulgences, papal infallibility, the Immaculate Conception, the Assumption, etc.) And as far as reunion, we might not have any luxury for waiting on reunion, because frankly, and I hate this because the thing that I want most is reunion between Catholics and Orthodox, I dont think its going to happen anytime soon. Some of the opinion that, If youre, for example, Orthodox and you become convicted of Catholicism, you should stay where youre at. Or, If youre Catholic, you can become convicted of Orthodoxy, stay where youre at. Or perhaps go to the other one to help bring them to unity. Having one mega bishop in the Catholic Church has done a lot of harm, as the "personality/mood" of the RCC depends on who hold the papacy, see Francis vs Benedict vs JPII.". So I assume that there is a kind of corresponding Orthodox Church. If you become convinced that the Catholic Church is the church established by Christ, you must act on your conscience. Im really honored. And in that way, maybe we make our contribution to it not being a thing for others to endure, but to be a thing, to bless others and to bless the whole world. Well, I think one troubling aspect that you might find is, for example, theres a lot of concern in Catholicism about prayers with people who are non-Catholics, sometimes thats seen as, Oh, this is a false understanding of a humanism and this is going against Gods will because youre praying with schismatics. And people think that, Okay. Search, Learn more about the Orthodox Church in America, Orthodoxy and Cults and Non-Christian Groups. Orthodox Christians consider Jesus Christ to be the head of the church, while the Roman Catholic Church is headed by the . I have to be able to guide them and shepherd my family and tell them, This is the church that Christ established. So ultimately we might not necessarily have the luxury of waiting 10 years. The idea that it doesn't matter is a recent ecumenist invention, drawn from the school of thought that says things along the lines of "meh, all Christianity is the same". I think it makes it worse. And thats why I dont recommend it because objectively speaking, youre putting your soul in peril. Rom. Visit the Online Chapel for more daily readings, hymns, a monthly calendar of saints and feasts, and more. Copyright 2015-2022. In the Old Testament the high priest could inquire of God via theurimandthummim(sacred lot), and if God chose to answer, the answer would be correct (cf. Twitter | I have difficulty accepting this view. On a subject this far from human experience, my feeble mind could not be relied upon. Should I become a Catholic, or Orthodox? : r/Christianity - Reddit It feels like Orthodoxy has really suffered a wound in recent years with some mutual excommunications. According to the Orthodox Christian viewpoint, it is not an exaggeration to say that the Church is necessary because of our very reason for being. 3 Jakques 6 yr. ago I frequent the orthodox subreddit. Yeah. There could be mitigating circumstances for a Catholic who goes from Catholicism to Orthodoxy. It was also worth noting the size difference between the two. We need your support in order to keep doing what were doing. All right, fair enough. So that goes the other way as well however. By virtue of our membership in the Church, our personal prayers are amplified and bolstered by the prayers of our fellow members in the Body of Christ. All rights reserved. (Apologies in advance if the nature of these questions is offensive in any way.). ' So I began to discern that and I spent a couple of years discerning Orthodoxy in addition to the previous years I had already put in. I want to become a part of a church. Scan this QR code to download the app now. Where do you go? It is characterized by its continuity with the apostolic church, its liturgy, and its territorial churches. In addition to that, though, he placed St. Peter at the head of the apostles in leadership, and that didnt die out in the first entry. Thats not to say that the Orthodox bishops dont have apostolic succession. You are using an out of date browser. this is based of off a mistranslation of Romans 5. you are born inclined to sin and mortal, but are only guilty of the sins you commit. From maintaining eye contact to managing arousal, here's her ultimate . It is in the church alone that we have access to the sacramental Mysteries. Reddit, Inc. 2023. Another thing is some people are troubled by what they feel to be liberal doctrines or universalism espoused in Catholicism. what you do see is that St Peter did have a headship, but it was in terms of honor and not jurisdictional authority, and nowhere does some kind of special place pass merely to his successors in Rome. I ask this question because recently, Orthodoxy has struck my interest. At a certain point in my life it became clear that I could not remain a typical American Evangelical. So if an Orthodox becomes convicted that they need to be in community with Rome, they need to do that. I really appreciate you discussing this with us. 28:1920), and it is worth noting that the Catholic Church has fulfilled this mandate more effectively than the Orthodox church has. But is this reason enough for me to belong? And faith is about the truth. With no pope to call or recognize ecumenical councils, the Orthodox havent had one in centuries. And what Ive noticed is that the more traditional converts lean to the Russian jurisdictions. P.S. Primarily it serves to 'undo' Peter's triple rejection of Christ during His trial before the rooster crowed. From this it can again be seen that Orthodoxy has a better claim to keeping the faith of the early Church than Catholicism does. The sex scandals is another one. To an Evangelical, Orthodoxy can seem like a way to have the latter without having to accept the former. Im not saying that youre automatically damned-. However honor doesn't necessarily mean authority, and certainly doesn't mean infallibility. The meaning of "Catholic" in Roman Catholic is "In communion with one bishop.". Even recent Orthodox Saints like St Pasios Of MT Athos repproved Contraception, And It seems more And more there's no consensus within Orthodoxy About it. The meaning of Catholic in Orthodoxy is the presence of the entire, fullfilled Church, possessing all the teachings and all the people - bishop, priest, deacon, monastics, and laity.
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